1 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:22,512 ROAD TO HOLLYWOOD HOW SOME OF US GET THERE 2 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:26,279 I'm going to America. 3 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:30,028 �FASSBINDER WILL WORK� ON BOX OFFICE? 4 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:32,630 I can work there. 5 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,389 FASSBINDER: THETALENT MOST ORIGINAL SINCE GODARD 6 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:43,120 I wouldn't call it emigrating. I just prefer to live there. 7 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:47,709 FASSBINDER IN HOLLYWOOD 8 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,234 If we see the evolution 9 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:58,473 from Rainer's work after the 60s, 10 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:01,229 until his death in the 80s, 11 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:07,908 and the great leap he took in 14 years, 12 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:14,515 we appreciate where it would have gone in the 80s and 90s. 13 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:16,591 One day he said, 14 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,833 when they asked what it felt like to work 15 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,157 in American studies with how free he was 16 00:01:24,320 --> 00:01:26,993 working in the European system. I didn't agree. 17 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:30,277 He responded that he preferred not to be free, 18 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,711 that way, imagine which was only in Germany. 19 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:37,793 I don't know what kind of cinema I would make today. 20 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:43,631 But the movies that he did not manage to do 21 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:46,837 They are an unimaginable loss. 22 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:53,430 PLANE OF MOVIE STARS 23 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:56,990 Rainer Werner Fassbinder didn't have time 24 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,953 to make your dream come true to work in America. 25 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:03,237 But many of his collaborators I know they made it happen. 26 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:06,557 Actors like: Armin Mueller-Stahl and Udo Kier, 27 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,188 directors of photography as Michael Ballhaus 28 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:11,590 and the late Dietrich Lohmann. 29 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:19,110 The first and only one who emigrated and settled in America, 30 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:22,317 When Fassbinder was alive It was Ulli Lommel. 31 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:27,358 Before making movies, 32 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,432 Fassbinder was author and theater director. 33 00:02:30,920 --> 00:02:34,196 Lommel's first clue in his search for the trail 34 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:36,828 of Fassbinder's influence in hollywood 35 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:41,551 takes you to a place where the director is still very present. 36 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:45,110 A small theater of Santa Monica, the City Garage. 37 00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:54,477 Your director, the French Fr�d�rique Michel, 38 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:57,069 intentionally rode the most controversial works 39 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:02,433 of Rainer to crash head-on with the frivolity of Hollywood. 40 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:04,996 And the City Garage works 41 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:08,197 like the famous "antitheater" by Fassbinder of Munich, 42 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:11,232 that revolutionized German theater in the late 60s. 43 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:17,109 Are you all in the work of eight? 44 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:19,839 - No. She does. - I do. 45 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,920 - Are you in any of Fassbinder's? - Me, in two. 46 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:23,990 Which ones? 47 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:27,157 "Garbage, the city and death" and "Pre-Paradise Sorry Now." 48 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:31,035 - Do you perform every night? - On Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays. 49 00:03:31,060 --> 00:03:32,395 For six weeks. 50 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,670 Those two were at the dance "Fuck me" that you liked so much. 51 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:41,630 Of course. 52 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:44,433 I am a fan of his movies. 53 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:46,388 And... 54 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:51,029 I read his works and I always wanted to do them. 55 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:52,036 In fact, 56 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:58,194 I was waiting for the right moment because many people were afraid of... 57 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:01,711 To mount his works, I don't understand why. 58 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:04,357 One day, I said to myself: 59 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:08,115 "Wow! I'm going to do it." And I did it. 60 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:10,356 It was very exciting. 61 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:14,229 I would like to act in: "The bitter ones Tears of Petra von Kant". 62 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:15,879 It would be very good. 63 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:21,191 I have staged three of his works, the first was: 64 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:23,278 "Blood on the cat's neck." 65 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:26,198 Then: "Garbage, the city and death." 66 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:28,595 And then: "Pre-Paradise Sorry Now." 67 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:33,510 I fell in love with the female character from "Blood on the cat's neck", 68 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:36,672 because that young woman, completely innocent, 69 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:39,519 come down to earth and know the men. 70 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:43,832 Men are bad and violent and what he learns is terrible. 71 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:48,198 He doesn't learn anything good about the world. 72 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:53,997 One of the critics He called me a fal�crat. 73 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:58,113 One review was very unpleasant and said: 74 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:03,396 "The main female character is naked from start to finish 75 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:05,198 with high heels". 76 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:09,758 The following weekend We filled the theater, obviously. 77 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,679 "Garbage, the city and death" It was banned in your country. 78 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:27,158 Heiner Müller tried to do it on the subway and they banned him. 79 00:05:27,320 --> 00:05:31,313 For me the work was not anti-Semitic, but on the contrary, 80 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:34,956 because the rich Jew is the hero. 81 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:37,037 He's a good guy. 82 00:05:37,280 --> 00:05:39,191 And maybe I'm wrong, 83 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:42,756 but my interpretation Fassbinder showed them... 84 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:46,317 to the germans what exactly they were like. 85 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:51,998 "This is how we are, we have to accept our monstrosity, we are like that." 86 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:06,030 I connect more with Fassbinder in the theatrical field, 87 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:12,429 because he fights against the same thing as me, as director. 88 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:16,236 All the questions you ask about life, 89 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:18,516 I do them too. 90 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,832 about life and what is beautiful or unpleasant. 91 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:24,916 For me, Fassbinder was beautiful, 92 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:29,631 and not Hollywood, Hollywood is fake. 93 00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:43,230 Ulli Lommel has been around for more than 20 years living in Hollywood. 94 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:47,717 From a family of artists, was already known in Germany, 95 00:06:47,840 --> 00:06:50,513 when Fassbinder hired him for his first film: 96 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:52,232 "Love is colder than death." 97 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,992 He acted in more than a dozen of Fassbinder films, 98 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:02,991 before becoming director. 99 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:07,153 With Fassbinder's advice, which produced his first films. 100 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:10,678 Lommel just finished his twentieth film in America, 101 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:13,792 took to Hollywood a little Fassbinder with him, 102 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:17,310 represents one of the clues by Fassbinder in Hollywood. 103 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:28,160 In 1968, 104 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,996 I was filming a musical for German television. 105 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:34,829 And... 106 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:38,152 During the tests, 107 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,636 a guy showed up, I had a small role. 108 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,231 And he was always in a bad mood. 109 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:49,359 He never greeted anyone, Nobody liked him. 110 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:53,309 I found it fascinating. 111 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:58,238 We looked at each other from time to time, but he was also very shy. 112 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:03,673 One day, during rehearsals, I decided, like a ten year old child, 113 00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:07,232 take a piece of paper, write something and... 114 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,758 I threw it to him. He picked it up and laughed for the first time. 115 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:16,636 He read it, he wrote me another message and he threw it at me. 116 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:17,869 I opened it. 117 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,875 In my message I said: "What are you doing tonight?" 118 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:24,956 He answered me: 119 00:08:25,160 --> 00:08:26,388 "I'm going to the movies." 120 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:28,956 "I'm going to the movies with you." 121 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,074 That night we went to see: 122 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:36,759 "I am the revolution" with Gian-Maria Volont�, 123 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:39,349 and Lou Castel, an Italian western. 124 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:42,872 Fassbinder and I didn't talk much. 125 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:49,199 The important thing is that we laugh at the same moments 126 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:51,795 and we cried at the same moments. 127 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:55,557 and that was the beginning of our friendship. 128 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,593 After the movie, 129 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:01,434 he told me: 130 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:06,037 "I will soon also direct my first movie". 131 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:07,519 I said, "Yes?" 132 00:09:07,680 --> 00:09:11,150 It was the time of the new German cinema. 133 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:15,148 In Munich everyone wanted to be a director. 134 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:17,954 It was another boy who, obviously... 135 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:20,391 I wanted to be a director. 136 00:09:20,680 --> 00:09:22,671 And he told me: 137 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:26,312 "I want to introduce you... 138 00:09:26,680 --> 00:09:30,309 To the woman... the actress who is going to be... 139 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:33,589 "I'm going to make her a super star." 140 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:35,871 I told him that everyone said that. 141 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:38,679 Everyone who wants to be a director they have a girl, 142 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,950 who is going to be the new star." I accompanied him to... 143 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:50,913 A dive, full of smoke, beer and so very noisy... 144 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:56,275 And I looked and no one seemed to me a movie star. 145 00:09:56,560 --> 00:10:01,680 And I said: "Where is he?" He said: "That's it, it's clear!" 146 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,512 And he pointed me to... 147 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:05,119 A waitress. 148 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,640 And it was, obviously: Hanna Schygulla. 149 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:11,874 He never told me, 150 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:16,352 that already, at the drama school, 151 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:23,111 had a flash, a sudden revelation, 152 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:24,912 that that girl, 153 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:29,357 with whom I had barely spoken, 154 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,469 and much less about personal things, 155 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:39,557 would become the "star" of his films. 156 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,149 One Monday at seven in the morning, 157 00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:45,479 The phone rings, I answer. 158 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,239 And a lady tells me: 159 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:54,949 "In an hour and a half "It must be in Rainer's apartment." 160 00:10:55,160 --> 00:10:57,469 I said, "For breakfast?" 161 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,271 And he said to me: "No! "We're going to make a movie." 162 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:03,590 I said, "A movie, what kind?" 163 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:08,072 "Only Rainer knows that, come here and find out." 164 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:10,709 So I went. 165 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:14,836 I was hoping to find myself to a film crew. 166 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:16,069 There was nothing. 167 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,553 Only Dietrich Lohmann was there, the director of photography, 168 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:24,918 with a 35 mm camera, It wasn't even a BL. 169 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,516 You couldn't record with it nor the original sound. 170 00:11:28,680 --> 00:11:31,194 A 35 mm camera. 171 00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:34,392 Nobody else. He did everything, the light... 172 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:38,354 The movie changed. There was only him. 173 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:42,872 And I said, "My God, "What am I getting myself into?" 174 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:47,035 Fassbinder said: "You're not dressed for the part, 175 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:53,475 you have to go buy a coat and a hat. 176 00:11:53,680 --> 00:11:57,355 you have to look like to Alain Delon in: 177 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:01,834 'The silence of a man'. I wanted him to go buy it for me. 178 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:05,277 Coat, glasses and hat. 179 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:07,316 I'm looking for some round glasses, 180 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:09,630 like those of the cop from "Psycho", 181 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:12,473 that came closer to Janet Leigh's car. 182 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:17,668 Rainer loved to make appointments, 183 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:24,393 I didn't hide it. As Brecht said: 184 00:12:24,560 --> 00:12:27,154 "Intellectual property does not exist." 185 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:30,312 He returned home and said: "We are ready! 186 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:34,231 Stand against the wall, the camera is rolling". 187 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,198 Then he said: "Cut! 188 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,670 "That's it." I went to ask Hanna Schygulla: 189 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,671 "What is this about?" he replied: "I don't know, ask him. 190 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:45,913 "Only he knows." 191 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:50,431 He knew what he wanted in the picture, It didn't explain anything... 192 00:12:50,640 --> 00:12:53,200 He didn't say much. 193 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:56,232 And I: "Is there a script?" "No, it's in his head," he says. 194 00:12:56,400 --> 00:13:00,552 "What do I interpret?" and he told me than the gangster, the main role. 195 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:31,273 Why have you done that? 196 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:38,911 You made fun of Bruno. 197 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,111 And he is my friend. 198 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:47,358 - And me? - You? 199 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:49,958 You love me anyway. 200 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,472 About that cake, 201 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,312 he told me: 202 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:03,472 "You have to want it, "that way it won't hurt." 203 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:09,877 But the first time it hurt me, I was scared that it was so strong. 204 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:14,752 I realized, that I had put... 205 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:18,916 More strength than necessary. 206 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:21,918 He's a brute, he's very... 207 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,833 Often cruel and... 208 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:30,629 And he has a reputation for being a monster as director. 209 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:32,518 Which I like, 210 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:36,514 because I think to be a good director, you have to be... 211 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:40,276 Strong, have strong ideas and... 212 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:45,117 It also has strength because it always works with the same actors, 213 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:48,317 the same group of people. 214 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:52,957 They know him and they know each other and that is the best way to work. 215 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:55,590 On filming, 216 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:59,872 Fassbinder never gave instructions of how to act. 217 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:02,998 It created an atmosphere... 218 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:04,669 On the set, 219 00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:10,392 in which the actors knew what was expected of them. 220 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,359 What to do and what not to do. 221 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,274 When a star came, 222 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:23,517 who had not worked with him and he dared to ask him, 223 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:27,235 what was the motivation about the character, he told me: "Ulli... 224 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:32,634 Can you explain it to him? "I don't like to talk about that." 225 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:35,993 The famous term "star" 226 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,598 I adopted him soon. 227 00:15:38,760 --> 00:15:43,311 Which shows that despite of its subversion, 228 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:50,399 he wanted to be associated with the "star-system" 229 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:55,873 and I know I dreamed of Hollywood. 230 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:01,029 I described myself like a suburban Marilyn. 231 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:03,716 But... 232 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:08,029 The coin had two sides. 233 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:13,757 On the one hand he tasted success, 234 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:15,433 on the other... 235 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:20,195 I was very reluctant. 236 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:26,079 It is important to be known. 237 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:31,713 But be able to bring something out from within, 238 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:33,472 whatever... 239 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:40,354 ...very deep, that has to come from the unknown. 240 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,911 Fassbinder and Ulli Lommel They spent a lot of time at pinball. 241 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:50,995 There was also a jukebox 242 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,630 and I started to dance. 243 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:59,915 It was great to dance, because I was dancing only with him. 244 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,755 I danced with him and for him. 245 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:08,755 He was magnificently restrained. 246 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:12,516 For us it was an indirect way... 247 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:15,875 To show our love. 248 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:21,198 That we only showed in the movies. 249 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:24,473 It's all in that dance. 250 00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:30,793 His way of looking at me and my way of moving for him. 251 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:36,836 We never rehearsed it. We just did it. 252 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:41,318 It was one of the moments happiest of the shoot. 253 00:17:47,120 --> 00:17:48,473 Rainer always... 254 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:54,152 I wanted to have a role. The interesting thing is that... 255 00:17:54,360 --> 00:17:56,078 When he acted, 256 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:00,588 He didn't interpret himself, like many other actors, 257 00:18:01,360 --> 00:18:07,469 but I wanted to do tough and American. 258 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:11,713 In "The American Soldier," 259 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,595 he wears a white suit 260 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:20,158 and moves like Robert Mitchum or Elvis Presley. Very American. 261 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:22,591 He used to say: 262 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:27,788 "I couldn't work in Hollywood, my themes are very German". 263 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,152 But his German films They were very Americanized. 264 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:35,472 Drop the weapon and put your hands up! 265 00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:55,470 Ricky! 266 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:07,910 I learned to make movies going to the cinema 267 00:19:08,120 --> 00:19:14,878 I tried to enter, twice, to film school and was rejected 268 00:19:15,120 --> 00:19:16,712 due to "lack of talent." 269 00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:21,317 I've been going to the movies since I was five years old. 270 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:24,352 It was the only thing... 271 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:29,479 What you had fun with as a child. 272 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:34,958 At least, me. I guess That's why I want to make movies. 273 00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:40,757 Typical gangster movies from Hollywood, the B series... 274 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:46,911 I didn't know them, I wasn't interested. 275 00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:51,069 For me they were very macho. 276 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:56,714 Raoul Walsh, a great director of genre films, 277 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,670 He had a lot of influence on Fassbinder. 278 00:19:59,960 --> 00:20:04,078 To the point that I called to the protagonist of his first film, 279 00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:06,629 "Love Is Colder Than Death", Franz Walsch, 280 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:10,679 Germanized, but obviously, as a tribute to Raoul Walsh. 281 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,276 He also took this name as a pseudonym, 282 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:19,036 in credit titles in assembly. 283 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:23,910 A very personal answer to this, is very affected 284 00:20:24,120 --> 00:20:25,519 for "Red Hot". 285 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,639 One of Walsh's films, in which the mother, 286 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:32,037 the evil mother plays a significant role. 287 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:34,152 I read in an interview 288 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:37,590 what they asked him their relationship with mothers 289 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,031 What if he had taken it? from "Al Rojo Vivo". 290 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,116 Fassbinder responded: 291 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:48,268 "I found my relationship with mothers watching 'Red Hot'. 292 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:54,432 A mirror of psychology by Fassbinder. 293 00:20:54,680 --> 00:21:00,198 Fassbinder was also a big fan from "The Free Slave" by Walsh. 294 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:03,876 He was inspired by that film to make a western in cinemascope: 295 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:07,715 "Whity", his first open tribute to Hollywood. 296 00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,470 "Whity" was filmed in a town near Almería, 297 00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:14,996 a popular filming location for spaghetti westerns. 298 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:17,151 But in addition to acting in the film, 299 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:20,637 Ulli Lommel also produces it. 300 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:22,871 The protagonist was Günter Kaufmann. 301 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,430 As for the small roles, 302 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:28,670 I wanted to do... 303 00:21:29,120 --> 00:21:31,111 Cowboys... 304 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:32,469 What has he done? 305 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:34,596 ...that they hit someone. 306 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:38,199 He identified a lot with the role. 307 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:42,831 He took it so seriously as a method actor. 308 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:47,038 After shooting the shot, 309 00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:50,272 while we worked in another scene, 310 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:54,831 took the bottle of Cuba Libre and threw it against the camera. 311 00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,438 "Whity" was my first movie with Fassbinder. 312 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:03,909 At the beginning our relationship It was a little strange because... 313 00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:07,590 He didn't trust me much... 314 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:11,992 I thought it was one I had made a lot of TV in Germany. 315 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:14,549 It wasn't clear to me. 316 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:20,716 Then there was a complicated scene and long, four and a half minutes. 317 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:27,751 It was very complicated because it went from one actor to the other. 318 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:32,397 And the time had to be precise It had to be in the person, 319 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:34,198 while she was talking. 320 00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:36,750 And everyone was waiting. 321 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:41,155 He showed me the shot and to the people what they wanted. 322 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,517 The actors were there. And we did it. 323 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:46,477 And he explained them to us well. 324 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,189 Fassbinder said: "How much time do you need?" 325 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,473 Ballhaus said, "Give me two hours." 326 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:55,837 Rainer said, "I'll be back in two hours." 327 00:22:56,240 --> 00:23:00,711 Two hours later he returned and Ballhaus was ready. 328 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,878 And we shot it two or three times. 329 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:05,359 Fassbinder told me: 330 00:23:06,120 --> 00:23:09,157 "I'm dying to see the rushes. 331 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:11,675 "It's not going to work," he said. 332 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,191 Two days later watching the rushes, Fassbinder remains motionless. 333 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:17,678 You can't believe what you see. 334 00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:21,271 Everything works, It's phenomenal, the light is magnificent. 335 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:23,351 The travel is fantastic. 336 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,910 It worked, the time worked, he storms out of the theater 337 00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:28,672 and shouts: "Ulli!" 338 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,518 And I said to myself: "Maybe he hates it, "Maybe he sees it differently." 339 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:35,597 I go out and say, "What?" 340 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:42,475 With tears in his eyes, he tells me: "This guy is a fucking genius." 341 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:46,275 Fassbinder demanded a lot from him to Michael Ballhaus. 342 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:50,712 I understood that I had found a formidable camera, 343 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,189 and asked for a set of mirrors. 344 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:57,796 There were mirror shots and then another mirror and another... 345 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,718 We loved mirrors, to him and me. 346 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,719 As everyone knows, filming mirrors, it can be... 347 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:08,031 A bummer, it can be very difficult. 348 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,950 So when I was wondering... 349 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,433 "Can you do it, will it be okay?" 350 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,711 I told him: "It's difficult, but it's nice." 351 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:22,399 "Difficult, but beautiful." 352 00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:24,596 His way of working... 353 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:29,079 Our movies were cheap, We didn't have much money... 354 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,789 We had to be very fast. 355 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:38,189 And he demanded a lot and tried to make it work fast. 356 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:40,710 I had to be very fast. 357 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:44,749 We didn't have the money either. to take many shots. 358 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:50,116 So we filmed little, He had, more or less, 359 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:54,990 the sequence of a scene, in his head. 360 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,197 So we knew what images were assembled together. 361 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:04,437 And it was very useful to know where the images were adjusted. 362 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:07,558 So I learned to think in terms of... 363 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:13,075 Not from individual images, but in sequences of images, 364 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,550 that completed a scene. 365 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:21,354 For German filmmakers and filmmakers in general, 366 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:26,878 Hollywood is like Mecca for Muslims. 367 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:28,991 I don't believe... 368 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:35,518 What a Fassbinder draw strength from that. 369 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:37,478 It's true... 370 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:39,831 What did I hear him say: 371 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:44,517 "I want to make films as effective 372 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:47,917 like those in Hollywood, but not so hypocritical." 373 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:48,990 AND... 374 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:55,473 That's why I admired so much to Douglas Sirk, 375 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,313 who became his mentor. 376 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:02,194 I needed a father figure. 377 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:08,197 That gentleman, exiled German, played an important role in his life. 378 00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,638 Fassbinder was obsessed with Sirk. 379 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,196 And that started in the sixties or early seventies. 380 00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:21,390 In 1971 he saw six Sirk films at a retrospective, in Munich. 381 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:25,030 And then he went to visit him, and ended up acting in a student film, 382 00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:30,996 of a realization course taught by Sirk. 383 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:33,077 We've talked about it... 384 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,993 If he makes another movie... 385 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,231 We will do it together. 386 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,277 In a very short time, 387 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:47,394 I stopped watching the movies to know the man who made them, 388 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:50,910 to work with that man, under the guidance of that man. 389 00:26:51,120 --> 00:26:54,669 That was a very strong relationship. 390 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,912 And of great interest to Fassbinder. 391 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:02,597 His response to Sirk It's fascinating. 392 00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:05,349 So intense, so personal... 393 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,275 When you read his article about Sirk, 394 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,398 the interesting It says so much about Fassbinder... 395 00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:18,033 It is so subjective that it says from both Fassbinder and Sirk. 396 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,714 He calls them the most tender movies, 397 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,991 the most beautiful in the world and really... 398 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,156 He praises them excessively. 399 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:29,630 And then he calls them desperate, sad and pessimistic. 400 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:35,158 I think it responded to a dualism in which he was, between... 401 00:27:35,360 --> 00:27:39,876 The objective world, in which everything was orderly and happy 402 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,395 and inner suffering. 403 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,910 The important thing about Sirk's films, 404 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,355 is learning 405 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:51,588 that human emotions, 406 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,198 no matter how small they are, 407 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:56,794 in the cinema, 408 00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:02,719 They get as big as they can. 409 00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:07,912 That's important for young people. who make movies. 410 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,391 After meeting Sirk he did: 411 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:13,511 "The merchant of the four seasons". 412 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,634 Before I had made half a dozen of low budget films, 413 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:23,033 most genre, "The Merchant" It is the first of its bourgeois period, 414 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:28,951 where you look at social relations intense in small spaces, 415 00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:33,870 In this case, a working family, a husband and a wife. 416 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,114 -Who am I? -Hans. 417 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,792 Meet my friend Harry. My wife. 418 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:48,679 Good morning. 419 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:54,310 Good morning. 420 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,198 - Are you the Harry of the Legion? - Yes. 421 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,031 - Hans has told me a lot about you. - Well, I hope. 422 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:02,679 Always good. 423 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:05,991 It's going to work for me. 424 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,157 Nice to meet you. 425 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:11,509 Thank you so much. 426 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,551 This month we have won almost 2,000 marks. 427 00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:18,954 Harry works well. 428 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:21,752 I haven't said anything. 429 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,590 His most famous film in which you can see Sirk, 430 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:29,435 It is his remake of: "Only heaven knows," 431 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,949 "We are all called Al." 432 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:36,312 Where does the basic situation take of an older lady, 433 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:37,919 who falls in love with a young man, 434 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:42,716 and has to face the scandal of the society that surrounds it. 435 00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:45,357 So he renounces the man. 436 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:49,354 And in many ways, He regrets that decision. 437 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:54,600 I also really liked Sirk, but I met him later... 438 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,871 All his movies They have many qualities, 439 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,954 but "only heaven knows" I didn't get excited. 440 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:06,834 Fassbinder's film, 441 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,111 I was very excited, 442 00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:12,238 not because it was him... 443 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:15,717 He owes a lot to Sirk, 444 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,799 but the relationship between Jane Wyman and Rock Hudson, 445 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:21,399 It wasn't... 446 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:24,715 Scandalous enough. 447 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,555 How not to accept it the petite bourgeoisie. 448 00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,399 But to Salem and Mira 449 00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:35,878 we can only worship them, if we free ourselves 450 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,555 of the ballast we have accumulated, 451 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:46,149 in middle class education. 452 00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:48,880 Also the movie is more... 453 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,277 More tender and human... 454 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:54,153 In what it shows. 455 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:55,715 I have gotten married. 456 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:00,515 What? 457 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:03,357 - Mother? - But... 458 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,551 With whom? Who have you married? 459 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:09,269 Happens. 460 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:13,996 My husband. 461 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,433 The Hedi Ben Salem Mubarak Mohammad Mustafa. 462 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,229 I call him Ali. 463 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:40,750 Don't go. 464 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:45,195 Bruno! 465 00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:49,911 You shouldn't have done that, mother. 466 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:52,235 Not that. 467 00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,199 What a shame! 468 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:56,996 You can now forget about your children. 469 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,634 I have nothing to do with it with a whore 470 00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,593 Rainer Werner always insisted 471 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,718 in integrating your own experience in his movies. 472 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,277 Even if the models, 473 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:13,432 They came from American cinema, by Douglas Sirk, 474 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:18,235 what it said in the movie, 475 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:23,755 It was something experienced, lived. 476 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,710 And it was full of... 477 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,909 All kinds of things I collected 478 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:37,750 of people's lives, theirs, of his actors, of his friends... 479 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:40,356 But they were consolidated in life. 480 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:41,430 one day, 481 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:46,348 Fassbinder, a group of people and me 482 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,398 we were at the airport from Frankfurt, 483 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:51,590 We were going to Greece on vacation, 484 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:58,113 The flight was canceled and Fassbinder I looked at the information panels, 485 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,629 the next flight I was going to Los Angeles, 486 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,231 He said, "Let's go to Los Angeles." 487 00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:07,433 Me: "What?" Him: "Yes, let's go to Los Angeles." 488 00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:11,673 I didn't go, I went back to Munich, the others went with him. 489 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:13,592 It was a 12 hour flight. 490 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:19,072 And over the course of 12 hours, wrote a work: 491 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,598 "The bitter tears by Petra von Kant. 492 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:28,399 that immediately It was adapted for cinema. 493 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:30,273 When they arrived, 494 00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:37,152 and everyone wanted to go to Hollywood, to the beach or typical L.A., 495 00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:40,158 He said to come back, 496 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,670 who wanted to film "The bitter ones" Tears of Petra von Kant". 497 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:47,475 He used very very language... 498 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:49,797 Precise. 499 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:56,232 It was a piece of theatre, but made as if it were for cinema. 500 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,830 It had a specific rhythm, similar to that of Brecht. 501 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,919 You couldn't change a word, 502 00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:07,396 nor delete anything because otherwise the rhythm would be lost. 503 00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,239 for that I had great sensitivity 504 00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,432 Things are the way they are in Germany. 505 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,553 Tell me about yourself. 506 00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:17,590 From me? 507 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:19,872 There is nothing to tell. 508 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:21,955 Well... 509 00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:25,796 What you think or what... 510 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:30,269 Dream. 511 00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:36,356 Not much, I want to find my place in the world. 512 00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:38,079 Is it too much to ask? 513 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,795 No, on the contrary. 514 00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:42,319 On the contrary. 515 00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:46,632 For that... 516 00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:49,393 We all live. 517 00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,469 To fight for a place. 518 00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:57,995 But... 519 00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:00,439 Do we have to fight? 520 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:03,869 Clear. 521 00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:08,273 I had to fight, it was hard. 522 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:14,038 Fassbinder had a lot of interest in the vision of women. 523 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,271 And it can be seen in his movies, 524 00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:19,472 he is very attracted to feminine sensitivity 525 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,478 and in seeing the world through from the eyes of a woman, 526 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:27,833 whether they are exploited, or humiliated or the weakest... 527 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,794 From the couple, or sometimes, They are the exploiters, 528 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:37,431 or the strongest, but in a way or another, the majority of his cinema, 529 00:35:37,720 --> 00:35:40,359 seen from feminine sensitivity, 530 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:42,715 or from the female character. 531 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,630 My first 360° trip, 532 00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,436 I did it in a Rainer movie who was called "Martha". 533 00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:54,752 And I remember it quite well. 534 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:57,634 It was the scene where the two... 535 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:03,353 Leading actors, who had a romantic relationship, 536 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:05,239 They meet for the first time. 537 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:10,355 Rainer wanted it to be a moment that everyone will remember. 538 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:13,996 All the public, It is a very important moment. 539 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:16,271 So we thought how... 540 00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:23,195 How to make it look that the two connected. 541 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:25,479 I suggested 542 00:36:25,720 --> 00:36:28,439 that we make a semicircle around them, 543 00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,637 and they get into it and look at each other. 544 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:35,875 He looked at me and asked me So why not a complete circle. 545 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,396 I said: "Okay, once again, it's difficult, 546 00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:42,668 but nice." 547 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:44,639 The problem was that... 548 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,955 The patio where we filmed it It was on the slope. 549 00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:54,433 And if you take a 360° trip, the tracks have to be leveled. 550 00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:57,155 So to level, 551 00:36:57,240 --> 00:37:03,873 the actors had to get on to a step 30 � 50 cm high. 552 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,510 I thought it would be impossible, but Rainer made them do it 553 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:10,996 and they did it, so we turned them around, 554 00:37:11,240 --> 00:37:15,836 and also made them turn to the actors themselves. 555 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,794 It became a famous shot, that everyone remembers. 556 00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,997 Since we liked it a lot, Afterwards we used it a lot. 557 00:37:24,720 --> 00:37:28,474 Make me a 360° plan around me. 558 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:44,037 With a camera like this it's easy, having to look is another story. 559 00:37:44,240 --> 00:37:48,756 Working with Fassbinder for 9 years, 560 00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,752 We made sixteen movies together, 561 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,271 was of great importance in my career. 562 00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,032 Not only because I learned a lot working with him, 563 00:37:59,240 --> 00:38:02,949 but also because his work It was known in the United States. 564 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:05,236 So when I started here, 565 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,109 They introduced me as the Ballhaus who had worked with Fassbinder. 566 00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:10,838 "Ah yes," they knew him. 567 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:15,636 The entire film industry I had seen many of his films. 568 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:18,352 Martin Scorsese, 569 00:38:19,240 --> 00:38:23,358 For me, he is one of the directors most important in Hollywood, 570 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:28,352 and it has something who looks like Fassbinder, 571 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:33,469 has a very precise idea of the film on the visual plane. 572 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,831 Like Rainer, He has images in his head. 573 00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,716 And that makes working with him be wonderful. 574 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:45,277 First of all, have a director with such a great imagination, 575 00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:48,358 of images and the other thing is that... 576 00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,429 If you are so synchronized with a director, 577 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:56,714 think the same about shots, on how to film the sequence. 578 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:02,318 He likes to move the camera like I do and how Rainer liked it. 579 00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:08,516 This is all very similar to my experience with Rainer. 580 00:39:08,720 --> 00:39:12,599 And I enjoy it a lot, because it's like a continuation 581 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:17,828 of the employment relationship that I had with Rainer all those years. 582 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:21,116 Hey? 583 00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:23,869 Can I talk to Andy Warhol? 584 00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:26,760 In 1977, 585 00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:31,471 I went to the Chicago festival, It was my first time in America. 586 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:35,078 We went with the movie: "Adolf and Marlene." 587 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:39,756 It was very successful and the last day of the festival, 588 00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:42,633 an American distributor He tells me he wants to buy it. 589 00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,075 and introduce me to Andy Warhol. 590 00:39:45,240 --> 00:39:48,038 I want to talk to Mr. Warhol. 591 00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:49,839 So they took me to New York. 592 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:53,510 And they projected the film and "The tenderness of wolves." 593 00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:57,474 Andy loved them and at dinner he told me: 594 00:39:57,640 --> 00:39:59,312 "What is your next project?" 595 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:04,395 Something told me you would be interested to produce a film with me. 596 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:08,917 So I made up a story What could happen in New York. 597 00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:12,197 As soon as I told it to him, he told me: 598 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:15,438 "I like it, "Could we shoot it in New York?" 599 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:18,797 Three months later we shot it in New York. 600 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:23,715 I would like to know what you think from a phrase by Godard that says: 601 00:40:24,080 --> 00:40:27,675 "Cinema is a place for crime and magic." 602 00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:35,751 I still don't understand the part of the crime of the question, but... 603 00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:40,079 I have always believed that the magic part is... 604 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:41,549 When... 605 00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:46,116 It really shows the magic, you know? 606 00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,151 And especially in people... 607 00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:52,759 There are people who have that magic when the camera turns to them. 608 00:40:53,720 --> 00:40:57,110 There is like an extra energy. 609 00:40:57,440 --> 00:40:58,475 For some. 610 00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:02,519 In beautiful people, that is very different. 611 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,275 When they know they can get that extra magic on the screen. 612 00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:08,635 I don't understand it, but it happens. 613 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,677 Can I take a photo? 614 00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:12,429 Forward. 615 00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:22,910 He liked "Blank Generation." We had a lot of fun. 616 00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:27,278 I got a lot of momentum in New York and later in Hollywood. 617 00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:30,710 Without Andy I would never have arrived to Hollywood. 618 00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:34,549 And without Rainer I would never have known to Andy in New York. 619 00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:39,231 They are two crucial stages in my life. 620 00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:42,913 During the filming of: "Satan, the reflection of evil", 621 00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:46,032 It started snowing in Maryland, on the East Coast, 622 00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,197 for the first time in 150 years, 623 00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,358 in the month of October. 624 00:41:55,640 --> 00:42:00,475 My wife and I decided... 625 00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:05,359 Go to the West Coast to finish the movie. 626 00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:08,193 Most movies scary americans, 627 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:12,630 They are series B. 628 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:16,833 Personally, 629 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:20,868 I wanted to do a commercial film. 630 00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:24,191 The Washington Post review said: 631 00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:27,312 "An imagination heated teutonic", 632 00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:28,909 about the movie. 633 00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:32,230 I grew up, like many others, 634 00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:34,872 of the new German cinema, 635 00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:37,638 with American cinema. 636 00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:40,754 My heroes were Anthony Mann, 637 00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:43,188 Nicholas Ray, 638 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:46,508 Sam Fuller 639 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:50,234 Fritz Lang, 640 00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:52,074 and John Ford. 641 00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:58,275 They all performed his best works 642 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:00,999 here in Hollywood 643 00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:03,635 working for the studios. 644 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:07,360 So when I arrived in 1978, 645 00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:10,032 hired by a studio, 646 00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,594 I said to myself: 647 00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:18,396 "If these people have done fantastic movies here, 648 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:23,635 Why don't I know anymore? will you be able to do?" 649 00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,757 Coppola and me we realized later. 650 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:31,708 There were two systems in conflict. 651 00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:36,996 I didn't want to leave my position... 652 00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:39,876 As an independent director. 653 00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:46,032 And Francis wanted to produce the cinema just as I understood it. 654 00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:52,199 American studies and cinema European author are very different. 655 00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:59,310 In fact, I didn't want to work as an author. 656 00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,478 I wanted to work in the same conditions 657 00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:05,519 that Hollywood filmmakers from the 30s. 658 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:07,671 I wanted to do it for my studies. 659 00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,149 Maybe I was a little naive. 660 00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:12,236 Well... 661 00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:16,791 My encounter with studies It was quite disastrous. 662 00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:21,357 - Do you plan to stay and work here? - I think so. 663 00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:29,477 Unless you make several failures. 664 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:31,438 In that case no. 665 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:35,036 I returned to Paris. 666 00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:40,550 And I met Fassbinder in a cafeteria. 667 00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:44,593 I asked myself how things were... 668 00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:46,235 In America. 669 00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:51,109 He said, "We'll see. 670 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,515 Remember that Americans... 671 00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:58,669 They get excited quickly. 672 00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:01,594 But they'll stand you up just as quickly." 673 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,231 And then he said: 674 00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:12,079 "What depresses me the most from this moment, 675 00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:14,029 is... 676 00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:18,472 that many people He thinks I'm great. 677 00:45:18,720 --> 00:45:22,395 At first it was controversial. 678 00:45:22,840 --> 00:45:26,799 It was fun. Now the international press, 679 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,549 the New York Times calls me the best director for the last 50 years. 680 00:45:30,720 --> 00:45:34,679 What do I do now? Where do I go from now on?" 681 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:38,960 On April 14, 1980, year... 682 00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:42,669 In which "The Tin Drum" by Volker Schl�ndorff, 683 00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:46,554 was selected for the Oscars, Fassbinder was in... 684 00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:49,916 Los Angeles the day from the Oscar ceremony. 685 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,150 But I wasn't there for that. 686 00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,397 He had gone to Hollywood to look for actors for his next film: 687 00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:59,030 "A song... Lili Marleen." I wanted an international cast. 688 00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:00,235 And the winner is: 689 00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:04,318 The Federal Republic of Germany for "The Tin Drum." 690 00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:13,389 I met Rainer again at the 1980 Oscars, 691 00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:15,511 in Los Angeles. 692 00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:23,429 I was surprised to see it with tuxedo and bow tie. 693 00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:28,158 I had never seen him like this, It didn't fit him very well. 694 00:46:29,440 --> 00:46:31,874 He had found out 695 00:46:32,240 --> 00:46:35,152 of my problems with Coppola for my movie. 696 00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:38,316 We were looking from above 697 00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:41,677 the hustle and bustle of Hollywood. 698 00:46:42,240 --> 00:46:46,791 He put his arm around my shoulders and he told me: 699 00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:50,675 "Wim, I know you have problems. 700 00:46:52,240 --> 00:46:58,475 If you want me to beat him up "To Coppola, tell me where he is." 701 00:46:59,480 --> 00:47:01,675 And he would have done it. 702 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:06,318 I did everything I could so that he would be away from Coppola. 703 00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:09,557 I think I would have hit him a punch 704 00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:13,149 I was in the mood for that. 705 00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:20,069 Not even those conventions, Not even the Oscars were with him. 706 00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:26,519 I think he was looking for a conflict 707 00:47:26,680 --> 00:47:30,639 to show the world what I thought. 708 00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:34,430 At that time it would have served a fight with Coppola. 709 00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:38,398 I think the interest of Fassbinder for American cinema, 710 00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:40,789 would have taken him to work in America. 711 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:42,558 He had an apartment in New York. 712 00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:46,031 He kept what he wanted to do movies in America. 713 00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:48,998 Even the films what he did in Germany, 714 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,317 each time they were made more international, 715 00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:56,115 "A song...Lili Marleen", "Querelle", 716 00:47:56,440 --> 00:48:01,639 they were more lavish with an international cast. 717 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:09,077 We shot "A song... Lili Marleen", in English, 718 00:48:09,240 --> 00:48:11,993 in the hope that it would be a global success. 719 00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:16,591 I think it became at its greatest success. 720 00:48:16,720 --> 00:48:21,032 It reached an audience, 721 00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:24,149 which had never reached him before. 722 00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,671 �Its purpose was to make a super production? 723 00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:57,997 Until now he had made movies low budget. 724 00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:03,796 Money has never mattered to me. I always try to have the budget 725 00:49:05,240 --> 00:49:08,755 that fits to what I want to tell. 726 00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:12,151 Now that you've done this great movie here. 727 00:49:12,600 --> 00:49:15,194 Do you dream of going to Hollywood? 728 00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:19,279 Not in any way. 729 00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:23,909 But I would like to live in America. 730 00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:28,436 Once there, I'm sure he will make movies. 731 00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,433 That's something else that led him to America, 732 00:49:31,600 --> 00:49:36,515 the German system was increasingly more restrictive, due to censorship, 733 00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:38,830 or for the supervision of the cinema. 734 00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:42,311 I was no longer free to make the films what he had done until then. 735 00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:45,480 The next time What we saw was... 736 00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:47,551 In Cannes. It got... 737 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,750 In front of a camera for the last time. I was making a documentary, 738 00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:53,913 "Room 666", 739 00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:58,957 in which the filmmakers They talked about the future of cinema. 740 00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:01,953 Rainer Werner also entered in that torture room. 741 00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:07,234 He said very emotional things. 742 00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:12,151 We make fewer and fewer movies. 743 00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:13,673 And we are only interested... 744 00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:19,314 For a particular cinema: the sensational, 745 00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:22,398 great pompous movies. 746 00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:26,670 It is seen everywhere. 747 00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:29,032 On the other hand, 748 00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:30,989 like i already said, 749 00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:32,993 subsists 750 00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:35,756 a very personal cinema 751 00:50:36,240 --> 00:50:39,118 and maybe national. 752 00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:45,870 Which is more important 753 00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:50,954 that the type of cinema that is no longer distinguishable from television. 754 00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:57,198 Never seen this movie. 755 00:50:58,080 --> 00:50:59,479 When I finished it, 756 00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:02,432 Rainer had already died. 757 00:51:03,560 --> 00:51:07,030 For me, the only interest of that film... 758 00:51:12,960 --> 00:51:15,428 It was... 759 00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:22,116 It was the first time that I felt clearly, 760 00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:26,877 in such a tangible way, that films survive us, 761 00:51:27,040 --> 00:51:28,917 everything we expose like this. 762 00:51:29,240 --> 00:51:31,754 All films will survive us. 763 00:51:32,720 --> 00:51:35,837 And all the movies, whatever they try, 764 00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,839 They talk about life and death. 765 00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:42,991 Until that absurd documentary. 766 00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:46,994 I had to work day and night, without sleeping, among other things, 767 00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:50,835 because I thought that if he fell asleep He would die and that scared him. 768 00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:53,195 And the incredible thing is that it was like that. 769 00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:57,794 He fell asleep on his floor, in June 1982, and he died. 770 00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:03,110 I was right about not sleeping because death would sneak in. 771 00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:07,519 Death would defeat him when I was sleeping. 772 00:52:15,160 --> 00:52:17,754 Douglas Sirk wrote his obituary: 773 00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:21,117 "Today I lost a good friend and Germany to a genius. 774 00:52:21,320 --> 00:52:24,551 I never thought it would come the fateful day, in which I, 775 00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:27,752 much older, I would be writing these obituaries. 776 00:52:28,520 --> 00:52:32,308 Fassbinder has left us a work prodigious of more than 40 films. 777 00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:35,358 So magnificent in shape, as in content. 778 00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:39,192 His films were for quite some time controversies, 779 00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:41,151 and let's hope they stay that way. 780 00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:45,990 Since it only lasts "what survives opposition." 781 00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:50,870 It's not easy... 782 00:52:52,320 --> 00:52:57,917 Speculate on what would have happened If Rainer had lived longer, 783 00:52:58,480 --> 00:53:02,871 If I had gone to the United States, If I had gone to Hollywood, 784 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:04,149 and worked there. 785 00:53:05,240 --> 00:53:08,755 The dream was always there that we would work here, 786 00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:10,359 I had an agent here. 787 00:53:11,160 --> 00:53:13,628 But I wasn't so sure... 788 00:53:14,520 --> 00:53:18,991 I should have changed your attitude at work. 789 00:53:19,120 --> 00:53:24,114 we all know who was a very strong leader. 790 00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:28,552 And the way people works in the United States... 791 00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:30,588 It's different. 792 00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:34,316 Very different way where we worked in Germany. 793 00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:38,679 I think I would have done one or two movies, 794 00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:42,833 I think always I would have returned to Germany. 795 00:53:43,040 --> 00:53:46,191 It would never have been enough... 796 00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:48,594 I believe... 797 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:53,075 Disciplined and hypocritical... 798 00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:59,077 Or eager for success 799 00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:02,994 how to be part of the Hollywood system. 800 00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:07,830 I think Fassbinder I would have been very disappointed. 801 00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:13,558 Here you don't have real freedom to do what you want, I think. 802 00:54:13,720 --> 00:54:17,998 There is always someone behind with money that tells you what you have to do. 803 00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:22,592 And even if you tried be very true to yourself, 804 00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:25,195 I think that in Hollywood it was impossible, 805 00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:28,118 except now with independent films. 806 00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:32,068 So I don't think that it was possible to really do... 807 00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:37,196 The type of movies what he wanted to do, in Hollywood. 808 00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:40,832 Of course that would have made a movie. 809 00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,511 Would it have been a Fassbinder film? I think not. 810 00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:50,358 I think in March 1980 I was ready to take the step, 811 00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:53,031 and I think there would be... 812 00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:56,152 It would have stirred things up. 813 00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:58,754 Because I didn't accept... 814 00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:06,593 The Hollywood vision Honestly, I didn't accept... 815 00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:11,436 That there were heroes and bad guys in the way Hollywood sees them. 816 00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:14,792 Sometimes I have gotten very angry. 817 00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:19,673 I have insulted and cursed him 818 00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:26,231 for the fact that it was before his own death, 819 00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:28,476 with eyes wide open. 820 00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:31,791 Sometimes I have said to myself: 821 00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:36,308 "Shit, I didn't need to." 822 00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:38,678 But it's absurd. 823 00:55:40,240 --> 00:55:42,151 What is past is past.